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Post by lordyam on Feb 12, 2016 15:49:41 GMT -5
Why has the market shrunk though?
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Post by Jason Aiken on Feb 12, 2016 16:56:52 GMT -5
The King Conan numbers are perfectly fine, in line with DH expectations for a KC mini. I bet Truman/Giorello get another mini after this one, maybe even two. As long as they can keep sales btwn 5-7K, they are doing fine there. The main title is the problem. It needs a long rest, complete editorial overall, and a higher profile creative team. As mentioned, Red Sonja sells an easy 20K a month but to accomplish that, they had to scrap their old creative team and editorial direction, bring in an A-List writer, and market it to mainstream fans. Well, Conan tried this with Wood and it bombed. They need to try it again but with a proper mandate ala the Busiek era to do Conan true justice. We'll see. I still think DH is just playing out the string on their license agreement and that Conan will be finding a new home soon. Don't forget, Red Sonja is a Dynamite Entertainment book. True Red Sonja may sell more than Conan, but there are also variant and incentive covers involved iirc. If Conan would go to Dynamite, I wouldn't mind for sales reasons, but I don't like the way Dynamite handled the recent John Carter: Warlord of Mars series, if that's a barometer. It started out great, then quickly deteriorated. I found that happens to a lot of their pulp related titles. Bring in A-List creators for the first arc, then the book drastically declines in quality once they're gone or take a back seat. I'd rather Conan be at DH and sell around 9-10K than go to Dynamite and sell 20K. But the main title needs a new editor. Whoever's in charge of it doesn't know what they're doing from a perspective of art direction. Probably for the best right now. Needs to take a break and come back with a fresh look.
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Post by lordyam on Feb 12, 2016 20:35:42 GMT -5
I checked the numbers. Conan's still beating the shit out of mirror's edge, eve, dragon age and every other liscenced brand EXCEPT Buffy.
Combined Buffy earns Dark Horse $87,093.72 while Conan earns $50,080.75. If Dark Horse ha to choose they'd choose buffy but honestly I'm pretty certain they'll ditch mirror's edge and eve LONG before they ditch conan.
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Post by johnnypt on Feb 12, 2016 22:32:13 GMT -5
That seems to be a pretty quick turn around on the Wolves trade, it ends in March, the trade is out four months later. There are probably only two more Chronicles of Conan left after this next one. With the way DH's titles are selling right now, they can't really afford to have Conan on the sidelines for too long. We used to think the series had a solid 10k fan base, which dropped to 8k, now what? 6k? Then again if mid level DC and Marvel books are selling in the mid 20K range, what should a good level be for Conan? Is it fine where it is? I think the difference this time is there's really no buzz about a future team or title. Fred was named Conan writer in October 2013 and his first issue was in April 2014, so we knew something when Wood's run ended in February. This time, there is complete radio silence out there. Not even a hint of something.
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Post by lordyam on Feb 12, 2016 23:08:19 GMT -5
I think they'll give it a short break and regroup. In any case mirrors edge will get the axe long before Conan; same with EVE.
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Post by rednails on Feb 13, 2016 4:23:52 GMT -5
I've been an ardent follower of Conan since Marvels first issue, and I honestly think the problem is us, the loyal fans who buy every issue, no matter the quality. Lets be honest, Marvel did a lot of good stuff with Conan and other ReH characters, due to good writers/editors and artists, but even they got it wrong on numerous occasions (IMHO). So, DH approach has been the same, a lot of good, but now marred by a lot of bad, particulary the Wood/current era (Fred excluded). So, any way you look at it DH are guaranteed a reasonable return on the current offering due to people like myself who keep buying and hoping it will improve (and because we don't want to break a run etc). After all, the amount of comment that Woods run attracted and still does, did it provoke a boycott, no, a steady core kept on buying. I have to agree with earlier comments, be careful what you wish for with a move to dynamite.
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Post by Wolfshead on Feb 13, 2016 11:39:19 GMT -5
I believe IDW would be a better, more respectful place for Conan. They seem to handle their licensed properties, like Judge Dredd with far more regard for their history. Dynamite will just continue a slide with better artists, but pandering, worse writer's than FVL. At least that seems to be their history with Red Sonja and others. IDW seems to find better writer/artist teams.
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Post by lordyam on Feb 13, 2016 14:53:27 GMT -5
I think that dark horse should just adapt the final tales, and maybe include two miniseries (one which shows Conan's rise to kingship and the other his final fight with Thoth/the end of the prince story.) they cleaned up with artists and the art in avenger still outpaces a lot of wood's art
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Post by lordyam on Feb 13, 2016 15:04:28 GMT -5
Also I noticed something. Angel and Faith season 10 and the sequel to fight club will be ending in March or April. Fight club 2 is the REAL moneymaker (20000 issues and more) so I'm wondering.....how will the loss of fight club 2 influence dark horse
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Post by Wolfshead on Feb 13, 2016 15:10:29 GMT -5
I think that dark horse should just adapt the final tales, and maybe include two miniseries (one which shows Conan's rise to kingship and the other his final fight with Thoth/the end of the prince story.) they cleaned up with artists and the art in avenger still outpaces a lot of wood's art I honestly don't know why you want DH to continue. They've screwed the pooch too many times (Truman, Giorello & FVL excepted) to trust them. I honestly don't find Chiang's cartoons an improvement over what was usually in Barbarian (of course Lolos set a new low for comic art, one that was extraordinary even for Barbarian). If DH cintinues with Conan, which I don't forsee, they will just drive sales down to the point that no other publisher will want to take on the license anytime soon, if ever. Better that they drop the title rather than make a bad situation even worse.
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Post by lordyam on Feb 13, 2016 15:37:49 GMT -5
Except that Dark Horse has more reason to keep Conan; their other liscenced brands (Eve, Call of Duty, Dragon Age, Mirror's Edge) are all doing pretty badly compared to conan (in the 3000 to 5000 range). And honestly, Lolos wasn't even the worst art in Barbarian (the black stones arc and nightmare of the shallows arc both had art atrocious enough to make Ching look like the next coming of Tomas Giorello). Compared to those abominations Ching was the second coming.
Also Fight Club 2 will be ending and that was pretty much their main moneymaker for the past couple months (the only one to do more than 20000).
I figure that Dark Horse is already 2/3 of the way through and they've gotten better writers in a lot of ways. So there is a chance art will get better. I also want to see the story end.
Besides, some of the stories after Roy Thomas left were downright abominable. Jim Owsley was able to pull the series out of the fire and make it respectable again so I think Dark Horse can as well.
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Post by rednails on Feb 14, 2016 4:16:22 GMT -5
ok, so I was wondering what you guys think, DH do an expanding and popular range of figures based on Game of Thrones. Dynamite did a series of comics based on the first book, which was ok, but slow in coming out and had up and down art, especially the last few issues. if they have the license for merch, its always struck me as odd that they don't do a comic etc. if they do it right it could be a game changer for the company, but I think it would be the end for Conan at DH.
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Post by televiper on Feb 15, 2016 16:23:30 GMT -5
IDW would be the ideal home for Conan. They do licensing right.
Dynamite would not be great because they always, always skimp on art.
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Post by lordyam on Feb 15, 2016 17:08:16 GMT -5
I'm not too sure. The MLP comic has a lot of shit in it as well. And in any case, even if Dark Horse wanted to ditch Conan they can't. What are they going to promote instead? Mirror's Edge Exordium? Eve Valkyrie? With the exception of buffy Conan easily outclasses the licensed brands. Conan isn't as profitable as it once was but it's not so unprofitable they'll ditch it. Mirror's Edge and EVE will go long before Conan gets the axe
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2016 17:17:48 GMT -5
If DH axe Conan he'll be very upset, You remember how he reacted last time
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