|
Post by Von K on May 25, 2020 7:31:14 GMT -5
I got my critique back, it was not too brutal. Apparently I overdid it with details. I will keep this criticism on mind for future edits. It's going to be hard to let go of my beloved sagaris. Congrats Char-Vell. I've prepped my piece but am still wondering whether to send it in. Will your entry be appearing on their blog?
|
|
|
Post by Char-Vell on May 25, 2020 9:40:53 GMT -5
I got my critique back, it was not too brutal. Apparently I overdid it with details. I will keep this criticism on mind for future edits. It's going to be hard to let go of my beloved sagaris. Congrats Char-Vell. I've prepped my piece but am still wondering whether to send it in. Will your entry be appearing on their blog? Yes. It's up now.
|
|
|
Post by Von K on May 28, 2020 16:05:22 GMT -5
Congrats Char-Vell. I've prepped my piece but am still wondering whether to send it in. Will your entry be appearing on their blog? Yes. It's up now. I hope you don't mind me linking to it here Char-Vell: killzoneblog.com/2020/05/the-dangers-of-detail-derailment.html#commentsYou did damn well to get not only a unique blog post featuring it but also one by James Scott Bell himself. It was a great piece you sent in and I too got a strong REH vibe. I agree with JSB's two observations (detail/viewpoint). It might be well worth picking up a few of JSB's cheaper books on amazon about writing at some stage. I've got three of them flagged for purchase after spending a while cribbing notes from his interviews. I've read a whole slew of writing books and advice over the years and I can say that imho his writing advice is practical and solid for anyone following the commercial pulp route. He himself learned some key aspects of his craft from Jack Bickham, another good teacher of the craft whose books on writing are worth reading. Anyhow, more congrats from me.
|
|
|
Post by Von K on May 28, 2020 16:46:19 GMT -5
PS I think you have to make adjustments for the fact that the critiquers at Killzone blog are mostly thriller writers. I don't think your historical details, which you worked in naturalistically imho, would throw a reader of historical fiction, which is closer to the target audience. So don't abandon the sagaris just yet. I sure as heck ain't abandoning my Iberian falcatas any time soon.
|
|
|
Post by Char-Vell on May 28, 2020 18:37:12 GMT -5
Thanks for the praise!
I hadn't heard of James Scott Bell before, so I googled him and saw his credentials were impressive.
I may have overdid the details up front, I really wanted to get the setting across.
I wish they did a "middle page critique", I'd like to see what they'd think of the weird stuff.
|
|
|
Post by themirrorthief on May 28, 2020 19:53:33 GMT -5
im tempted but writing has begun to bore me unfortunately
|
|
|
Post by Von K on May 29, 2020 16:49:20 GMT -5
Thanks for the praise! I hadn't heard of James Scott Bell before, so I googled him and saw his credentials were impressive. I may have overdid the details up front, I really wanted to get the setting across. I wish they did a "middle page critique", I'd like to see what they'd think of the weird stuff. Seeding in the setting details is always a tricky balance. Similar with working in backstory sometimes and the balance between text and subtext. I know what you mean about middle page critique. Qualified feedback can be hard to come by.
|
|
|
Post by Von K on May 29, 2020 16:52:51 GMT -5
im tempted but writing has begun to bore me unfortunately Maybe you just need time to refill the reservoir mirrorthief? After all you've written I can't see you walking away from it forever.
|
|
|
Post by themirrorthief on May 29, 2020 20:55:58 GMT -5
maybe if I write a novel about horny teen girls in love with nice vampire boys
|
|
|
Post by Char-Vell on Jun 3, 2020 8:03:29 GMT -5
PS I think you have to make adjustments for the fact that the critiquers at Killzone blog are mostly thriller writers. I don't think your historical details, which you worked in naturalistically imho, would throw a reader of historical fiction, which is closer to the target audience. So don't abandon the sagaris just yet. I sure as heck ain't abandoning my Iberian falcatas any time soon. I did a rewrite of the offending passage.
Sigyn the Aesir, late of Persepolis, had traveled the road to Heliopolis with no incident for eight days. On the ninth day, she was accosted by a trio of Sherden bandits. Thinking a lone woman to be easy prey, they learned of their error too late, and soon one of their number lay dying with a spear tangled in his guts.
Now the tawny-haired she-devil wiped the blood from her fierce green eyes and stared down the remaining pair from behind a tall wicker shield, a deadly Persian battle-axe gripped in her right fist.
“Come dogs!” she shouted. “Which of you would die next?”
Howling in rage, one bandit made a bold thrust, seeking her vitals, but his blade transfixed the wicker shield instead, narrowly missing her sinewy forearm. Sigyn twisted to one side, tangling the sword in the wreckage of her shield. Unwilling to release his weapon, the bandit was upended and tumbled to the ground.
She let the ruined shield fall with the hapless swordsman, and his comrade, seeing an opening, lunged recklessly in an attempt to decapitate the Aesir. Moving with preternatural speed she sidestepped his powerful blow. As the momentum from the spent attack sent him stumbling past her, she brought down the axe, shearing through his horned helmet and splitting his skull in a welter of blood and brains. He fell, sprawling upon the dry earth that thirstily sucked up his flowing blood.
The surviving combatants now circled each other, seeking an advantage. The Sherden crouched behind his shield and spat venomous curses at his enemy.
“Whore! Wretched she-dog! I know not what gods or devils aid you, but they will avail you no longer!”
The giantess bared her bloodied teeth in savage exultation.
“I need not the aid of gods or devils to kill a jackal like you!”
The Sherden closed the distance in an instant, seeking to impale her upon his short, leaf-bladed sword. The giantess spun away from his thrust, and his blade only scraped against the scales of her hauberk.
She swung her axe, bypassing the shield and cleaving his knee joint nearly asunder. A fountain of blood gushed from the wound and he fell, howling like a damned soul. Sigyn did not relent, and hacked into his neck, partly decapitating him. He crumpled like a felled ox, and the earth drank more Sherden blood.
|
|
|
Post by Von K on Jun 3, 2020 20:53:58 GMT -5
PS I think you have to make adjustments for the fact that the critiquers at Killzone blog are mostly thriller writers. I don't think your historical details, which you worked in naturalistically imho, would throw a reader of historical fiction, which is closer to the target audience. So don't abandon the sagaris just yet. I sure as heck ain't abandoning my Iberian falcatas any time soon. I did a rewrite of the offending passage.
Actually, I think your original passage was already strong, better as an in-media-res opening and more Howardian, but the second was smoother and better laid out and better paced. I've edited together a combo of the two, lifting out a few details and trying to combine the strengths of both in a single passage: I've only trimmed some details and reordered a few sentences. The idea was to slowly merge with Sigyn's viewpoint as the scene progresses so that by the end of the action we are in her POV, where we start to get more context, detail and backstory through her perspective. The details that I lifted out were: These details could be revealed later from Sigyn's PoV once the action is over and she is surveying her erstwhile attackers perhaps. And you effectively already seeded most of these details in with the action for the most part. In Queen of the Black Coast REH opens in media res with action and brief flashes of detail and only gives us a full description of Conan and his equipment when there's a lull in the action. The way he handles that opening is a good guide to how much detail to reveal and when for an in media res opening. The way he works the backstory and full description of Conan in with the narrative at a later point. I'm no great expert Char-Vell. That's only a little additional perspective from me. Apart from a few basics alot of this is down to pace and personal style and everyone does it differently.
|
|
|
Post by Char-Vell on Jun 4, 2020 6:53:03 GMT -5
I did a rewrite of the offending passage.
Actually, I think your original passage was already strong, better as an in-media-res opening and more Howardian, but the second was smoother and better laid out and better paced. I've edited together a combo of the two, lifting out a few details and trying to combine the strengths of both in a single passage: .... That's a lot of great advice, and you were able to keep the sagaris! Thanks!
I'm doing a rewrite of the whole tale to streamline it a bit, I'll keep all of this in mind.
|
|
|
Post by themirrorthief on Jun 4, 2020 22:32:00 GMT -5
I think Im gonna enter a writing contest n stead. I enjoy those and generally do ok with some interesting feedback
|
|
|
Post by Von K on Jun 5, 2020 13:40:35 GMT -5
Actually, I think your original passage was already strong, better as an in-media-res opening and more Howardian, but the second was smoother and better laid out and better paced. I've edited together a combo of the two, lifting out a few details and trying to combine the strengths of both in a single passage: .... That's a lot of great advice, and you were able to keep the sagaris! Thanks!
I'm doing a rewrite of the whole tale to streamline it a bit, I'll keep all of this in mind.
I do think Fantasy, Sci Fi and more obscure Historical periods (and related sub-genres like S+S, Steampunk, Post Apocalyptic etc) generally need more detail thrown in to establish their settings. Whereas genres with contemporary settings like thrillers can get away with less due to reader familiarity.
|
|
|
Post by Von K on Jun 5, 2020 13:42:11 GMT -5
I think Im gonna enter a writing contest n stead. I enjoy those and generally do ok with some interesting feedback I've prepped a few pieces but not actually sent one in yet.
|
|